Transcript:
Daniella Gibbs Léger: Hey everyone, welcome back to “The Tent,” your place for politics, policy, and progress. I’m Daniella Gibbs Léger.
Colin Seeberger: And here at home, I’m Colin Seeberger, because it is snowing today in Washington, D.C., Daniella.
Gibbs Léger: Yes, it is. And I must say, I am sick of the snow, but it is very pretty. This has been a very pretty snowstorm.
Seeberger: It has been pretty. I will say, generally, all the snow we’ve gotten this winter has been nice and powder-like. It’s not been that really gross, sleet, sludge kind of snow.
Gibbs Léger: Yes.
Seeberger: So, I share with you that I am also sick of it, but while the weather may have kept us here at home, it didn’t keep us from having a podcast this week. And I heard that you had a really great conversation.
Gibbs Léger: That’s right, Colin. I spoke with Slava Leontyev, who made the award-winning 2024 documentary “Porcelain War.” We talked about the war in Ukraine and the importance of hope and community and art in the middle of conflict.
Seeberger: I’m really excited to hear the conversation. But first, we’ve got to get to some news.
Gibbs Léger: We do. Now, Trump is putting on a big show trying to make himself appear strong and in control. But if there’s one thing that’s become clear in this past week, it’s that the wheels are coming off the car of his presidency. And here’s what I mean by that: A strong president, especially one that has majorities in Congress, works through the House and the Senate to accomplish the kinds of reforms Donald Trump is trying to make.
Congress has the power of the purse, and a strong leader would use that to their advantage to achieve their aims. But that is not what Trump is doing. Instead, he is trying to bypass Congress to make gargantuan funding cuts—to things like education, child care, nutrition assistance, and health care—that would have devastating impacts on the American people.
Because many of these cuts are extremely unpopular and could never get approved by Congress, he has sought to basically ignore our constitutional system of checks and balances, flout the law, and install lackeys who will do what he wants at all costs. And based on his first few weeks in office, we can see three clear ways he’s trying to make these cuts happen:
- Unleashing his billionaire donor, Elon Musk, on our government to gut things that matter to the American people, while not touching a dime of the federal contracts that have enriched his companies and helped make him the world’s richest man
- Using an illegal process called impoundment, basically abusing his authority to reject spending money that Congress has already approved
- Instructing federal agencies through executive orders and corrupt appointments to effectively grind to a halt the government’s work on behalf of the American people
Seeberger: That’s exactly right, Daniella. I mean, the tactics are just outrageous. There have already been more than 40 lawsuits in response to the administration’s actions thus far. And a handful of judges have actually put in place freezes—temporary restraining orders—on some of these different actions, like attempting to repeal birthright citizenship, which is just a clear violation of the 14th Amendment. One judge, who paused Trump’s federal funding freeze, even ruled that the administration had defied its order from the court.
Trump and his lackeys, they know that they’re breaking the law. It’s why you’re hearing Trump, Elon Musk, and Vice President JD Vance, the so-called champions of law and order, criticize and even seemingly try to intimidate the judges in these cases. Vance even said judges shouldn’t get in the way of executive power.
Maybe he conveniently forgot, but America was founded in defiance of a king’s oppressive rule. Judges, they have an obligation to hold the administration accountable for flouting these laws, especially when they’re just such blatant conflicts of interest and do real harm to the American people.
The New York Times reported this week, for example, that Elon Musk’s actions have stalled at least 32 investigations, complaints, or other enforcement actions by federal agencies that relate to his own companies. What a coincidence, right?
Gibbs Léger: Right.
Seeberger: And a few days ago, we learned his company, SpaceX, was actually awarded another $7.5 million contract by the federal government. Meanwhile, Musk and his teenage DOGE [Department of Government Efficiency] minions exact cruel, lawless cuts to programs that will actually result in real harm to thousands and thousands of people—some even causing them to lose their lives. It’s beyond the pale, Daniella.
Gibbs Léger: It really is, and it is the definition of corruption. Look, these judges are right to be hearing these cases because no one is above the law in this country, not even the president or his unelected billionaire donors. And these violations are having real consequences for everyday Americans.
Last week, we talked about how Elon’s dismantling of USAID [U.S. Agency for International Development] will end programs that keep Americans safe abroad, maintain our influence over competitors like Russia and China, and limit the spread of pandemics and diseases like HIV. It will also, as some Republicans have even pointed out, harm American farmers who make the food the department uses as aid.
Trump and his Cabinet of billionaires are also ripping away protections for American consumers by effectively halting the work of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, which has won tens of billions of dollars—that’s “b,” billions of dollars—back from greedy corporations for hardworking Americans since it was created by Congress.
Let’s be clear: Trump can’t shutter this agency without congressional approval. But by ordering a work stoppage and cutting off the agency’s funding, his administration is finding work-arounds. He’d love nothing more than to satisfy his political donors on Wall Street who don’t want to be held accountable for defrauding consumers.
Seeberger: That’s right, Daniella. And now Trump has slashed the budget of the National Institutes of Health (NIH). That is going to have disastrous implications for medical research, including for cancer, Alzheimer’s, diabetes, and other diseases. For example, the NIH helped develop a miracle drug for cystic fibrosis that has been a game changer for children who are now living instead of dying from the disease.
Russ Vought, the head of the Office of Management and Budget and a Project 2025 architect, he has a daughter with cystic fibrosis. His wife said in 2021 that she was happy our country led the way in medical innovation. But with people like her husband in charge, this type of lifesaving medical research will come to a screeching halt.
Why on earth does that make any sense? Research institutions are going to be forced to absorb a huge bulk of administrative costs, and many of them in red states aren’t going to be able to keep up. Katie Britt—the Republican senator from Alabama who gave the creepy response to the State of the Union last year, you may remember—she even expressed concerns about the NIH funding cut. And Sen. Britt, she’s as MAGA as they come. And don’t get me started on the latest DOGE announcements from the Department of Education. Let’s not forget that red states, of course, use more federal funding for their public education systems than blue states.
All this is to say, it’s clear we’re on the brink of a constitutional crisis. President Trump has chosen to let unelected billionaires—people who funded his campaign and their lackeys—into federal agency buildings, so they can take over sensitive payment and data systems and rip away the services that the most sick and vulnerable and hungry Americans need to stay whole. And he’s doing it because he knows this cruel agenda won’t fly even among his own so-called supporters in Congress.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah, as we said at the beginning, not the sign of a strong leader whatsoever.
Seeberger: Certainly not, Daniella. Well, that’s all the time we have for today. If there’s anything you’d like us to cover on the pod, hit us up on Twitter, Instagram, Bluesky, and Threads @TheTentPod. That’s @TheTentPod.
Gibbs Léger: And stick around for my interview with Slava Leontyev in just a bit.
[Musical transition]
Gibbs Léger: Slava Leontyev is a Ukrainian artist and co-director of the award-winning 2024 documentary “Porcelain War.” He also served in Ukraine’s special forces and is now an instructor for Ukrainian civilians who are helping protect their country from Russian aggression.
Slava, thank you so much for joining us on “The Tent” today.
Slava Leontyev: Daniella, thank you so much. Thank you for the attention. I cannot explain how much I appreciate it.
Gibbs Léger: Thank you. As a first-time filmmaker, you debuted with this beautiful film that has touched so many people. Can you tell our listeners about the film, how you decided to make it, and what you were hoping to accomplish with it?
Leontyev: Oh thank you for this question. It was really very first time for me, for Anya [Stasenko], for our cinematographer Andrey Stefanov. We are not filmmakers. We are porcelain artists, and Andrey is an oil painter, and we never filmed a movie before. We knew Brendan Bellomo, my co-director and filmmaker in Los Angeles, through our art.
And we have in our mind animation project, not about war, maybe for children. But when the big war broke out, Brendan called me. And he asked me just, “How are you? Are you in Ukraine? Are you still alive? And what are you doing?” And we answered him, “We are in Ukraine, and Anya continues her painting, and I try to help her during the night.”
And Brendan asked me, “What are you doing during the day?” And I answered about my activity in Ukrainian special forces. And Brendan, very gentle, very careful, asked me, “Maybe you are ready to film something around you?” And it was amazing opportunity to share our very personal experience, our very personal experience as artists in the middle of war, and as soldiers, and experience of my friends in my unit—regular civilian people who came to army as volunteers just to defend their homes and family, but also because they felt responsibility in the case of history. Because this battle is not a battle for Ukraine. It’s a battle between democracy and much more authoritarian lifestyle. Ukrainians do not agree with this totalitarian lifestyle. And we’re trying to defend not Ukraine only, but democracy in Europe.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah. You know, it’s hard to believe that it’s been nearly three years since it started. And many of our listeners have watched the war in Ukraine unfold on the news, but it’s hard to get a sense of what it’s really like for the people who live there. So, what were your experiences like during the early days of the war, and how did the climate shift as it moved on?
Leontyev: Well, we were really busy. At the time, I was focused on missions of my unit. I have really a lot of work, horrible schedule about this preparation because thousands of completely unprepared people came to army as volunteers and get these AK rifles. And it was horrible. They really need the time, preparation, and my help.
I cannot say something surprised me in this situation because I was prepared, and I understood what kind of war coming. But what was really amazing and spectacular: beauty of people around me. Because in really dark time, you know, kind people are starting to shine. We were just shocked at how kind, how amazing humans can be.
Gibbs Léger: Mm-hmm. I have to say that that is something that’s so beautiful—in the midst of this terrible condition, that you were able to find, sort of, these bright lights.
Leontyev: Also, maybe most permanent impression during the war: how fragile all around us is. And because in this project, we felt behind us our amazing American team, their creativity and professional skills. We were sure about the future of our footage, but we felt we are people on the ground, and our responsibility is to look around really attentively.
It’s normal behavior for us as artists, and we felt this fragility. And because of this, we filmed every piece of nature or every person, for every tall building, like if it was last day of their existence.
Gibbs Léger: Mm-hmm. So in the film, we learn that you stopped photographing for a while because you couldn’t find the things that you wanted to photograph. What made you decide to pick up the camera again? And you touched on this a little bit, but why is it important to document what happens during the war?
Leontyev: I cannot say I cannot find what to film, but I was really too busy and too much focused on security of my family, for example.
Gibbs Léger: Mm.
Leontyev: When we start to film this movie, I understood—thanks to bravery of reporters, of correspondents—we have completely enough footage of devastation.
And it’s senseless to film something extra because all devastation looks the same. All these crumbled buildings look the same. It’s senseless to kind of film news footage because after we will finish this movie, after a year or two, nobody knew who will survive so far. And we’ll have just old news interesting for nobody.
Much more interested to be focused on beauty, what can be destroyed because of this war, and to be focused on culture, because culture is the source of our resilience, the way of our resistance, and also culture is a main target of this invasion. Because Russians are trying to rebuild their empire and are trying to erase our identity and destroy our culture. Because this is the start of big war. Our museums were destroyed, our universities were damaged. And so many of our artists and artists and musicians, teachers of Ukrainian language and literature—any people who contribute culture—were killed because of this war, in random way because Russia shelling districts of apartment houses, or especially in concentration camp on occupied territory.
And nobody can fix this because nobody can bring these people back to life, and they never create something new. And it’s our duty now to work instead of all these people.
Gibbs Léger: Mm-hmm. So I want to talk a little bit about you and your wife and your decision to stay in Kharkiv and join the military to fight back. Can you tell us what went into that decision?
Leontyev: We lived—a long time we lived—in Crimea. And in 2014, after an action of Crimea, it was completely clear for us the big war will come because election was never punished. The Western world just ignores this president changing European borders, first after the Second World War because of invasion from outside.
And one of my friends, my future and now former commander, he is a historical professor of our state university. And his major, his most interesting—for him—subject is modern Russian war, like war in Chechnya. Because of this, he completely understood what kind of war will come to us. And he established our military preparation.
And we have many years to be prepared. Because OK, we never served in army before. We’re completely civilian, peaceful people, and we really need many time to be prepared and take this expertise about firearms. And when big war broke out, I was ready.
Gibbs Léger: So, we have a predominantly U.S. audience here on this podcast, and it’s no secret that the current president opposes U.S. aid for Ukraine and has used his influence to block funding time and again. He even went so far as to say this week that “Ukraine may be Russian someday,” quoting him.
What do you make of Trump’s attitude as a Ukrainian, and what would you say in response to that particular comment?
Leontyev: Of course Russia can get Ukraine. Russia can even get the whole Eastern Europe and Western Europe as well. Just let’s do nothing. It’s easy to do nothing, but result may be not so pleasant. Ukrainians already doing their best, and we will do our best because we have no other choice. America now have chicken policy and just run away, and we get all what we want. It’s a world of Russian propaganda now, and it’s a really dangerous state of mind.
Gibbs Léger: That’s right. So your team has been nominated for an Academy Award, among many other accolades. What has this incredible reception you’ve received around the world meant to you as both an artist and a Ukrainian? And what do you hope others might take away from your story?
Leontyev: I’m feeling horrible kind of responsibility because I’m here instead of all these brave Ukrainians who helped us.
Anyway, I was serving in Ukrainian army at the time when we filmed. And I was able to film something only because when I picked up my camera, someone picked up a rifle in my place. My friends, my unit, they decided it’s so important to share our experience, to bring this to audience, and of course, I am so happy and it’s such amazing honor. I cannot explain how humbled I am right now.
Also, as for me, my responsibility as artist and filmmaker is to bring hope and inspiration to audience. Because nobody wants watch war movie. Nobody needs war experience. But we can find hope, beauty, and inspiration even in the middle of this devastation. And I hope we are able to bring good news because main message of our movie is resistance is possible in any situation.
Kind people, regular people, can find opportunity, can find strength to defend independence and diversity, to develop culture and preserve humanity even in the darkest of times.
Gibbs Léger: Well, I think that is a fabulous way to end our interview and some words that really should be shared around the world. So Slava, I want to thank you for joining us on “The Tent” and wish you best of luck as you continue this award season.
Leontyev: Thank you so, so much.
[Musical transition]
Gibbs Léger: Well, that’s going to do it for us this week, folks. Please be sure to go back and check out previous episodes. Before we go, Colin, we got to talk about the Super Bowl.
Seeberger: Of course we do. It was amazing, the halftime show.
Gibbs Léger: It was something.
Seeberger: The football game, a little less so.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah—oh, you rhymed right there. You’re a poet. You didn’t even know it.
Yeah, the halftime show was fantastic. Just incredible. And I could do an entire segment on just Kendrick looking at the camera. It was so great.
Seeberger: Amazing. I mean, a meme that will live on for years and years to come.
Gibbs Léger: Forever.
Seeberger: But I also love the Serena Williams cameo, myself.
Gibbs Léger: I know. I know. It was just mwah, chef’s kiss. Just great. And visually very appealing as well, I thought. Just really great job. He’s so talented.
Seeberger: When they just started piling out of the car I was like, “Oh my God, when are they going to stop?”
Gibbs Léger: I know.
Seeberger: It was so cool. I loved it.
Gibbs Léger: It was very, very cool. It was both very visually appealing, but also kind of minimalist. But there were a lot of people involved. So, yeah, it was great. The game, not so much.
Seeberger: Ugh, whoop.
Gibbs Léger: It was a beatdown by the Eagles, man.
Seeberger: It was. I mean, did Pat Mahomes even bother to show up?
Gibbs Léger: I don’t know who that was.
Seeberger: That was crazy. They just could get no momentum whatsoever.
Gibbs Léger: Not at all. And you can’t blame [Travis] Kelce or the other receivers. I’m like, “He’s literally throwing at their feet.” What is happening?
Seeberger: It was a mess.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah, it did remind me, though, that their record said one thing, but they barely won a lot of their games.
Seeberger: That’s true.
Gibbs Léger: It wasn’t the Chiefs team of last year. The Eagles just kept getting better as the year came on, and whoo, man, they were like, “I’m going to put a period at the end of this season.”
Seeberger: Boy, did they ever. Yeah, I mean, it’s just another testament to just how hard it is to win the Super Bowl, much less do it not just two times but a third time in a row.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah.
Seeberger: There’s a reason why it hasn’t been done before.
Gibbs Léger: Exactly.
Seeberger: I think we saw quite clearly, based on Sunday’s game, just why that is.
Gibbs Léger: Exactly. And kudos to the Eagles. Yes, they are a division rival. I don’t dislike them as much as I like your team, Colin, just to be honest. There are some lovable people on that team, and I have been suckered in by their social media presence. They’re clever, they’re funny, they’re cute, they can sing—it’s just too much.
Seeberger: No comment.
Gibbs Léger: I’m sorry. Anyway … But I do wonder if this is the last time we’ll see Travis Kelce in a football uniform.
Seeberger: I don’t know. I mean, it depends. He could be a married man soon enough and have other responsibilities, so we will have to wait and see.
Gibbs Léger: Do we think they’re going to get engaged this year?
Seeberger: I mean, this was my prediction for 2024, and that didn’t happen, so I’m not making any predictions at this point, Daniella.
Gibbs Léger: I mean, look, for all we know, they could be engaged already.
Seeberger: That’s right.
Gibbs Léger: Speaking of being engaged—
Seeberger: Oh, that was a seamless transition right there.
Gibbs Léger: You like that? All right, let’s talk about “The Bachelor.”
What do you think of the season so far?
Seeberger: So, I feel like I’ve liked Grant, and I feel like he’s been pretty open and vulnerable and sharing why he is the way he is based on his own upbringing and family story, right? And I really like a lot of the women too. I think for me, I’m not really seeing the two go together yet.
And I realize it’s still early in the season, but like, I like a lot of the women, and I like Grant. I’m not really seeing some magnetic bond outside of maybe one or two people. So it’s still a little too early to say, but I’m hopeful for him.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah, I think that’s right. I feel the same way.
I really like Grant. I wasn’t sure how I was going to feel about him, because he didn’t leave a really strong impression on me from Jenn’s season, but I really like him as the lead. I think he’s really thoughtful. I think when the way he reacted to hearing somebody basically say that he said something not cool that he didn’t say, I was like, that’s the reaction you want and going to address it.
But maybe what we need is a change of scenery. They’re going to Madrid next week, so maybe that’s when sparks will fly.
Seeberger: I am very excited because Spain is on our family travel list this year. So I will be sitting there with my notebook writing down—or my phone—writing down all the places I need to go and see. Yes, I feel like especially like in the early rounds of when they travel, that’s when the chaos comes out.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah.
Seeberger: And I think that’s when the bonds really start getting, I feel like, much deeper. Because the group dates are less cluttered with 12 people, right?
Gibbs Léger: Exactly.
Seeberger: And are more like, “OK, here, there’s five people, you can actually have a real conversation with this person over coffee,” or whatever. So, yeah, it’s going to be a fun few weeks as we get out of the states.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah. Can’t wait. Love having that distraction every week.
Seeberger: It is on the books on Monday night.
Gibbs Léger: Indeed, and I am so thankful that their budget is back, so we are getting these beautiful locations. So, thank you, “Bachelor,” thank you, ABC. Because Lord knows, I need it.
Seeberger: We are going to need it.
Gibbs Léger: Exactly. All right, folks, take care of yourselves.
It is a bad flu season. I know I keep saying this, but I keep hearing how it’s really, really bad. So, I mean, you know.
Seeberger: Flu, strep, COVID, colds.
Gibbs Léger: All of the things.
Seeberger: Yeah.
Gibbs Léger: Yeah. So, please, do take care of yourselves, take care of your family and your friends, and we’ll talk to you next week.
[Musical transition]
Gibbs Léger: “The Tent” is a podcast from the Center for American Progress Action Fund. It’s hosted by me, Daniella Gibbs Léger, and co-hosted by Colin Seeberger. Erin Phillips is our lead producer, Kelly McCoy is our supervising producer, Mishka Espey is our booking producer, and Muggs Leone is our digital producer. Hai Phan, Matthew Gossage, Olivia Mowry, and Toni Pandolfo are our video team.
Views expressed by guests of “The Tent” are their own, and interviews are not endorsements of the guests’ perspectives. You can find us on YouTube, Apple, Spotify, Google Play, or wherever you get your podcasts.